Dungeon Siege Legacy - Discussion

So, I asked what I should name the main character of Dungeon Siege Legacy... and while sitting there; it randomly dawned upon me.

I should name him Norick, after his mother's dear friend! So henceforth, his name will be Norick.

Why not use the name of one of the first modders of the game. I know quite a few and I am sure iryan and sol77 could point out a few more.

I will certainly consider this. At present, I intend to write novels for the other games as well as create my own stories in the Dungeon Siege Legacy series.

Dungeon Siege Legacy: The Guardian of the Stars - about an Utraean who is inherited the position to guard the Clock Tower. It's supposed to take place after Legend of Aranna and perhaps after Return to Arhok. This was going to be the first story, but I couldn't find out an interesting enough problem to surround its plot.

Dungeon Siege Legacy: The Resurgence of the Seck - the prequel novel that follows the mother of the current protagonist; the events of the first game.

Dungeon Siege Legacy: The Cataclysm of Aranna - the sequel novel depicting the events of Dungeon Siege 2 and perhaps Broken World.

...

And perhaps more! Such as a book detailing the fall of the Empire of Stars.

Not complete, mostly because it's not polished and I have no idea how to do the y.

I know this was posted as sort of addressing a specific issue, but I hope you don't mind me brainstorming a bit here.

I like the Idea behind using Norick's name, or the thought that bare_elf shared- using a modder's name. However I have a third suggestion. As this is your realization of the story, and ultimately this is going to be your character experiencing Legends of Aranna, I think you should pick a name from any of your own past playthrough's that sort of fit the character you've sculpted thus far. Since you seem to be into immersion, I'm sure you picked plenty of names that really fit the rest of the world, yet sound bold enough for a hero.
I might have missed an update, or you might be keeping this character's identity a mystery for the exact purpose of developing a community-made character, but it sounds like you have at least settled on human male. Coming from a cold village in the mountains, and with tough and bold names like Hardison Dohn (The mayor, as I recall), it's not too difficult to see the connection to.. a generally Viking feel. That said, maybe some character names from a game like Skyrim would fit to some degree.
(I'm not sure why but two 'G' names came to mind. Grigori and Godkrieg)

On the subject of characters in general, have you any thoughts about adding extra's besides the actual cast of the game? Do you want as many interesting folk as possible even if they're not in the game, or are you looking to exclusively flesh out the characters that are already there? I like to think I'm pretty good at creating characters of mine own..

I think Jondar, being the first follower you meet, should end up being the hero's greatest ally. Or if nothing else, the 'co-star'. Determined and focused, he could be classed as a Fist of Stone, pretty sure the lore doesn't specify when such talents originate.. maybe he could even be the pioneer of such magics. He's the one who's concerned and troubled, while the Hero is generally optimistic. (Also I love how the Legendary mod makes him an elf, can that be a thing or..?)

Love interests? Get some romance in between all that stabbing and gutting. The only lass who's name I remember is Lyssa.. probably because you meet her in Arhok as well.

I intend to have the names be as canon as possible... and now that you mention, you have a good point; they do have a viking sound to it. The biggest idea of using Norick's name is that it would imply two things that basically help write the eventual prequel: 1. His mother's closeness to the old man and 2. That his mother is the Farmer.

As to the second part of the question(s), I don't want to add extra characters, but expand on the character's that are already there. Lyssa, for the one time she spoke, shown herself to be militaristic in nature, so I'll add more to this, maybe even to the point that I give a reason that she's like this. If I remember right, she knew the protagonist's mother, so that will definitely be put into the story. Also, on top of that, my interpretation of this is that she's probably considerably older than him, so it's unlikely she'll be a love interest... not to mention, even if they did fall in love, she probably wouldn't express it much and even make it a point to not express it.

As to the Elf thing, I'm pretty sure they were still in their forest. They had expanded into Aranna sometime after all of this, and some sources say that Dungeon Siege II didn't happen until a 100 years after Dungeon Siege. I don't think it was ever detailed how long it's been since they expanded, so I'm going to take a gander and say that it was 20 years before the events of DS2.

So, as to the third and final question; I have no idea. I haven't developed any of the personalities well enough to really go around and say who is likely to love who. So far, the character who is going to be the most different (as far as I can remember) is the Utraean who eventually joins them. With that said, I will likely use the name, but give him a different story and all that... but it really is hard to say as it's been a few years since I last played through the entirety of Legends of Aranna. I never really tried memorizing the story, so it will definitely be a difficult but certainly passionate journey.

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To summarize (and add some information);

Will I make up names to add to the series?

No; most likely not. I want them to be as canon as possible... so you can take from literally any of the games, though ideally you'd keep the Utraean names to the Utraeans and so on. Also, I've never used 'canon names' before, so it wouldn't really make much sense. Seriously, one of the names I used was Knight Bob.

Will the races introduced in DS2 appear?

No; as far as I can remember they had yet to expand out into Aranna, so it wouldn't make too much sense if you met any.

What if at least one Elf appears? It's not very likely for a single race to not have at least one diplomat that's out there somewhere.

(Obviously this isn't an asked question, but here's the response for it anyway.) True, but why would the Elves talk to Norick? Sure, he eventually becomes leader to a group that saves Aranna, but the story is about becoming the hero, not the aftermath.

Will I add any extra characters?

Unlikely; once again, I want to be it as close to canon as possible. I'm not going to give everyone fleshed out stories like Lord of the Rings or Star Wars.

Will Jondar, the first companion, become close friends with Norick? Will there be any romances?

While it would make enough sense to make this a thing, and even would make it easier... I don't actually know. I think all of them will be friends with each other by the end of the story, though it's possible some won't like each other and only tolerate one another. Hell, there's even a chance one of the characters will die! In the end, what this amounts to is that it depends on the personality they eventually will develop and initially express with the paragraph or two of dialogue.

WHEW!!! I don't think I've ever typed out that long of a response for... pretty much anything. Sorry if you have lives and can't read the entire thing in a single sitting (I know I don't have much of one and still wouldn't be able to do it in one sitting... but that's more of a statement of how many things would be on my mind and my energy). If you have any more questions, feel free to ask them!

If Kingdom of Ehb's hero is the Farmer, then Legends of Aranna's is the Child, or in full (in my opinion) the Adventurers' Child. The game tells us the names of both the child's parents - Orrin for the father (a dual nature and combat mage) and Feliene for the mother (ranger and nature mage). So even if one was the Farmer who defeated Gom, there is no room in that adventure for the other. In any case, piecing together the story of their expedition from fragments of the mother's journal discovered along the way, they come across not as already-experienced and successful adventurers but as bungling novices learning the hard way (judging by the equipment items lost - the Arhok's Lot set - and companions killed). In the end they died glorious deaths but the story leaves one big question - was it a glorious defeat (in which case who made their tombs?) or a glorious victory (in which case how come Nosirrom and his Zaurasks now control those tombs?).

You make an exceptionally good point there.
So unless Gom was actually an incompetent fop of an overlord, the farmgirl from Ehb probably wouldn't end up being Feliene.
I suppose you could argue that her abilities withered in the years, but I still doubt now..

Ashley Wickett, the old man living just outside town who you can meet shortly before Lyssa, is the NPC who talks about having known the Child's parents.

Three lasses in the party
1. Lyssa - potential relationship with Jondar?
2. Jharmaya (Utraean) - friend and colleague of Algher Manhur, and the leader of the pair; how will they interact with Nardulo who is obsessed with avenging his sweetheart killed by Zaurasks?
3. Mheagan, in the original game a young human (mainlander) stranded on the island in the half-giants' care, and like your Norick an orphan who has seen little of the world until now.

Just occurred to me - Therg "the historian" turns out to be more than he seemed. Jharmaya is one of his assistants, the most capable and the one showing most initiative, so his prize student. Could she be his actual daughter?

Two other companions, are they what they claim? - middle-aged Kraal "Yellowtalon", is he a recluse by force of circumstance, or by choice? Someone called Kraarl was one of Feliene's companions and the only one unaccounted for. Understandable if that man wanted nothing more to do with the Utraeans after realising how much of their past they'd been covering up. And Konus the dwarf - is he really a high crusader against the undead (him a combat mage, when nature mages' Purity spell and Life Force buff are what was wanted) or a low tomb-robbing scavenger spinning a yarn to suit his audience?

I am definitely aware that, in the games, that the parents of The Hero of Arhok are in no way related to the Farmer, at least as far as we know (I mean, for all we know she had siblings). In the story (both according to DS3 and mine), the Farmer worked together with a bunch of other companions she met along the way. So, this could mean either that she was a very talented leader or, at some point, someone else led. If someone else led, at least initially, it'd make sense if Gyorn, the one who already had some military experience, were the actual leader... though this would create confusion as to why the Farmer was the one who pulled through as the hero.

I think the best bet is this; Gyorn helped her a bit with strategy, but she only learned so much having spent so long with him (the time currently being unknown, but likely anywhere from a month to a year or two). 20 years later, many of the things lost their relevance as she did considerably easier tasks. Not to mention, out in the wilderness, just about anything can kill even the greatest warriors....

So... who really knows? Maybe it will continue to be a mystery. The next part isn't out yet, so his name isn't in stone yet anyway. Maybe I'll figure out something while I'm writing it? I most likely will. Nevertheless, I really appreciate your speculation(s), questions and effective knowledge of Aranna. After all, I'm not exactly writing this because I'm a master of the lore; I'm writing it because: 1. I can (it is free, so it's not technically breaking any laws) 2. I'm a fan of the series 3. I've wanted to for the last 5 or so years and only now have thought up a way that I like enough to release into the public.

P.S.

I nearly forgot! I had made a wiki! http://dungeonsiegelegacy.wikia.com/wiki/Everything

This should help keep track of the lore, especially the stuff I changed in it.

Two of the things I liked DS1 Ehb and Legends for are how much there is to learn - I wrote out detailed walkthroughs for my own amusement, that is why I could trot out those names for you so pat - and how much of the Ehb story is left to players' imaginations, or at least to reading between the lines. Which means plenty of room for different interpretations. Then GPG couldn't keep everything straight even within one game, let alone into DS2.

Less said about the movie the better from what little I've read, but if its scriptwriters could suit themselves why not you. Though if you do write a best seller using the names, settings and gist of the plot then I expect somebody's lawyer will turn up claiming to own the book rights.

People who've been coming to this and other sites much longer than I have may remember old discussions I never knew about. Was there one about what is the in-world date? (and therefore how old is Ibsen Yamas!)

P.S. Taking npc conversations as canonical doesn't mean you have to believe them. Some could be lying and others honestly deceived.

Well, I'm not going to be selling Dungeon Siege Legacy anyway. It's illegal!

So, many people have made good recommendations... which do you think would make a better idea?

A) Norick is his name and his mother was the Farmer.
B) His mother was someone completely different.
C) His mother was somehow related to Norick/the Farmer.
D) His mother heard the story of the Farmer, who said that Norick's death had something to do with why she left to save Ehb in the first place.

Seriously, i have no idea which to do, though I am adamant on a few details;

1) Legends of Aranna happens 20 years after Kingdom of Ehb
2) His parents would occasionally return, however not long enough for him to know them
3) He was raised by the people of the town, especially by Mayor Dohn who is sterile.

There was a timeline posted, I think Iryan may have a copy. I'll try to find mine

If you are, keep in mind I compiled that from references from the lorebooks in Kingdom of Ehb and LOA, many of those references have been superseded by lore from DS2 and in any case were very disjointed - it was very obvious that GPG never sat down and compiled a true backstory to base DS1 on, rather they filled in details as they worked on the game. Otherwise how can you explain Ibsen Yamas being 200 years old (one lorebook mentions he was born in the year 944 yet the events in KOE supposedly happened in 1144). Also Azunai's religion appeared nearly 1200 years before the events culminating in the destruction of the Empire of Stars, where Azunai himself was suppose to have been involved as according to the lore in DS2.

GPG obviously learnt from the mistakes of DS1 and spent quite a bit of time creating a backstory and history for DS2. Unfortunately a lot of that history overwrote what was stated in DS1 and probably LOA as well.

Have you referred to the Dungeon Siege history compiled by LoneKnight and found in the Game resources section to the right? It does a great job of compiling the history of Aranna as referenced from DS2 and also Throne of Agony.

A dungeon siege history by Lone Knight. http://www.siegetheday.org/?q=node/1122

I think that's the best option. After all, many young lads and lasses from small towns might grow up to be irresponsible. Having a child when they weren't ready for one, after all, they couldn't silence their wanderlust enough to be around for their own kin..
So it would make sense that they were akin to flights of fancy, wanting to be heroes like the Hero of Ehb and his/her followers.
And in doing so they cause the deaths of several other starry-eyed adventurer's.

Personally I would class them as bad parents rather than quiet heroes. So the child they were too irresponsible to raise was instead raised as the village child, and instead of telling him of how terrible his parents were as caretakers, they fluffed up their stories of greatness to make him feel better about their absence.
Funny how the magic in stories goes away the older you get, right? XD

But he always had that same wanderlust, thus why they called on him, as the most able-bodied fellow in Arhok, to solve their crisis.
Just my thoughts.

Just a possible scenario;

"I never really knew my parents all that well; all I really know is that they most likely died."

"So you're an orphan?"

Norick stayed quiet for a bit, thinking. "Huh. I never really thought about it like that. I mean, I was the village's child, so I feel like my elders are my parents."

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So, let's say that his parents had him when they were still young (anywhere from 16 to early 20s), and, still captivated by The Hero of Ehb, they named him after the one person she (the hero) looked up to. Not being ready to have a child, they requested Mayor Dohn to take care of him, and then left on their journeys. They would, on rare occasions, return to see him, but their selfish desire to continue to adventure eventually drove them to their deaths; whether this be because of a monster, bandits or even an accident.

But... as it turns out, the tendency to be adventurous ran in his blood, so to "pay" as thanks for taking care of him, he'd go out of Arhok from time to time to kill beasts that threatened them. By the time Legends of Aranna begins, he is already more experienced then an average person, but when he finally leaves his home far behind, he begins to learn more and more about who his parents were and how difficult it really is to be in completely different environments, though he obviously has some help from his companions.

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Arhok is known as being in the mountains, right?

Love it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUMvQ8E6DPs

Obviously you guys know this as Arhok's theme, and you wouldn't be wrong. But what if it were put in as Norick's theme? What would it mean?

Would it really encompass his entire personality? Would it miss a few notes; or would it only seem to as it subtlety encapsulates his true feelings?

"Swords to Ploughshares" is hard to reconcile with the Seck Rebellion anyway, but if its 844 date be granted as accurate I've two possible ways round it. (1) We are reliving the farmer's heroics 300 years in the narrator's past (2) The farmer's story comes at the end of 300 years from when the imperial trade presence created a government over a century before the War of Legions.

The Utraean Peninsula affair of the townstones can be the further adventures of the farmer (imported from a completed SP game into MP veteran level) in which case the second campaign must and the first campaign should post-date the last entry in Guard Relran's journal but this still allows early 1020s when Ibsen Yamas is about eighty.

I never completed the Valdis campaign (beginning of Act III was as far as I got) and have no idea of what lore is in Broken World and Throne of Agony. Did they really go back to amplify Ehb's history from DS1? Or did Lone Knight get much of his material on Lord Hovart and the 2nd Legion from non-GPG sources (the LoU mod, perhaps)?